You probably know Kal Penn from his successful acting career in hits like How I Met Your Mother, Designated Survivor, and the Harold and Kumar franchise, or as White House advisor to President Obama. His new memoir You Can’t Be Serious details why he rejected the idea of picking a “practical career,” growing up the son of immigrant parents, working in the entertainment industry, and behind-the-scenes scoop from his years at the White House. Penn is joined in conversation by Suroosh Alvi, founder of VICE Media.